![\"Glenn](\"http:\/\/www.covchurch.org\/uploads\/T5\/7A\/T57ANXEY9h2nbTX0IHMfLA\/Don-Glenn2.jpg\")
It\u2019s real hard not to focus on next steps and what I have to do between now and the day I move. It\u2019s hard to focus on work, you know. But, I have things that I still need to do.<\/p>\n
I have a trip coming to Indianapolis with the Lilly Endowment. It involves training in areas of philanthropy \u2013 fund-raising, mostly. I expect to do some work in that area in retirement, so it\u2019s timely. Some of the Lilly people have become friends over these years, and they specifically wanted me to come and do this before I left.<\/p>\n
I\u2019ve been reading the Book of Letters I received (a retirement gift containing hundreds of letters from colleagues and friends), so I think a lot about what has happened in the last 10 years.<\/p>\n
I\u2019m glad that the things that were most important to me \u2013 that I felt called to do \u2013 are values shared by Gary and others who will continue here. It\u2019s not a change that means now there\u2019s a whole new direction and things we\u2019ve been doing will be abandoned. That\u2019s very gratifying.<\/p>\n
It\u2019s been really enjoyable. Gary and I have been meeting weekly for an hour or two, talking about all sorts of things that he has questions about or I think he should know. That\u2019s been gratifying, to pass on recommendations, concerns, or telling him things that maybe one would not pick up on for a while \u2013 my perspective on what\u2019s important, what he needs to give attention to, people and relationships that will be essential to him. The new Department of Compassion, Mercy and Justice. It\u2019s in great hands – we\u2019ve got the right person in charge. And it\u2019s fully supported in the church and the Council of Administrators. I wish we had done it sooner – it was a dream from the very start – and it took almost the whole time to get it in place. It\u2019s no small thing to start a new department, and financially it\u2019s no small thing. It came about in a time when we were able to do it.<\/p>\n On biblical gender equality, I feel like we\u2019ve raised the visibility of the issue. We have maybe solidified the church\u2019s commitment to recognizing the giftedness of all God\u2019s people, regardless of gender. But, I think that is one where we have a long way to go. I\u2019m pleased with the progress, but I\u2019m not satisfied. This is an issue where real people have been called by God \u2013 it is not just a theoretical issue. It\u2019s an issue that involves people\u2019s lives, so it is one that I have a lot of passion about. But, I don\u2019t have a sense that now we\u2019ve fulfilled that. I feel that a lot more acceptance and progress needs to be made to live out what the church has said it believes. Addressing the seminary and its declined enrollment was important to me. We\u2019ve made probably the most progress there.<\/p>\n Another area of excitement for me is World Mission \u2013 the new directions that it is going. It\u2019s exciting \u2013 it\u2019s who we are. I\u2019m really excited for the next steps for the Paul Carlson Partnership, becoming more of a worldwide movement, focusing on some other areas while we continue our work in Congo. That whole Paul Carlson work is one of the most important, challenging and gratifying things to me.<\/p>\n One of the things I feel good about in the last 10 years is I think we have as a church called some very good leaders. And I think I have for the most part trusted them and allowed people to work, and I think that has resulted in progress in every area.<\/p>\n And the staff at Covenant offices – you know, that\u2019s one of the \u201cunknowns\u201d in the Covenant . . . the group of young people working in these offices. They\u2019re phenomenal. Such wonderful people, and passionate about ministry. They\u2019re here because of that. Many of them could go elsewhere and make more money. They\u2019re here because they are committed.<\/p>\n Another area of growth has been in getting the message out that to be a biblical church is to put evangelism and compassion, mercy and justice together. I don\u2019t mean that was new when I came into office; but it is something I\u2019ve emphasized the whole time, and I hear it all the time now. If somebody wants to describe the Covenant church, that\u2019s a likely description.<\/p>\n Look at the popularity of the Covenant website \u2013 that is a communication tool. I run into it everywhere I travel. People will come – and I may not have seen the story yet – and they\u2019ll say, \u201cThat was really an interesting story this week.\u201d That has grown and is growing – it\u2019s changed the church. You take that away and just look how disconnected we would be.<\/p>\n I could go through almost every area of ministry \u2013 each department – and say I feel really good about that.<\/p>\n Q: Looking back, are there any goals that remain unfinished, that frustrate you?<\/strong><\/p>\n I wish we had more stability financially. Churches are hurting, denominations are hurting right now, and I wish we had more stability. We do have more stability than most denominations, especially smaller denominations. Larger ones are pretty heavily endowed, but the smaller ones aren\u2019t. That\u2019s an area I feel I did not substantially address.<\/p>\n Part of the reason I decided to retire was that I don\u2019t know what\u2019s next for the church. To me that was a sign that it\u2019s because my call was over. I\u2019ve had this real sense of knowing when to get out of the way. God\u2019s got a lot more to do, and when the vision is gone, it\u2019s time for somebody else who has the vision.<\/p>\n So, I don\u2019t look back and wish we had done a lot more things.<\/p>\n Q: What are some of the funniest moments you recall?<\/strong><\/p>\n One thing that comes immediately to mind was traveling to Asia with Jim Gustafson.<\/p>\n I can\u2019t go to an airport luggage carousel without thinking of Jim. He would be almost crawling in \u2013 you know, there\u2019s those plastic pieces hanging where the luggage comes out into the baggage claim area? Jim would have those plastic pieces parted and his head in there watching for our luggage. We would get it and then run to get ahead of everybody to get to the line. And then, if the line was too long, he\u2019d be over there talking to someone – and the next thing you know, we\u2019re going through the \u201cmilitary only\u201d line. He\u2019s convinced them that they should let us go through there.<\/p>\n Just to be with him and his incredible energy \u2026 and his gift of relating to people and speaking their language. One day we were checking into a hotel and some people were making comments about us. He understood what they were saying \u2013 and they didn\u2019t know that. On another occasion, we were walking through an airport and there were some people making comments. I can\u2019t remember what it was, but it was something like, \u201cLook at those long-nose (or some feature) Americans.\u201d And Jim turned and said something in their language to them, and they just laughed hysterically.<\/p>\n Another highlight that comes immediately to mind was being in Congo with Jim Sundholm and Jerome Nelson. They were teasing me about my always getting special treatment – I got a warm shower, they got cold showers; I got special food sometimes and always got my own room. We just played that up all trip long. We still have little things we did in Africa that we still do when we see each other. Those are really fun memories.<\/p>\n And then staying with Curt and Marti Peterson and Sharon and I in Colombia at this really fun place. Or being with Jay Phelan and Dawn and Sharon and I in Prague.<\/p>\n Q: Are there recollections that bring a tinge of sadness?<\/strong><\/p>\n That takes no time at all: walking through the ghetto in Bangkok and seeing people being used and people\u2019s absolute lack of hope. And then the Congo – there\u2019s a lot in Congo that\u2019s emotional. I recall a day in one hospital when I had become separated<\/p>\n from the group and they were showing me things. Bob Thornbloom and I were with a doctor and we went into a ward where there was a little baby lying on a plastic mat with no sheet or anything, being given something intravenously.<\/p>\n It was so hot \u2013 you could just hardly be in there. There were no lights – just open windows and an open doorway. And there were people back there in the dark, lying in beds. Bob is pushing me from behind saying, \u201cKeep moving, get out of here.\u201d The stench was really bad. When we got out, the doctor said, \u201cWe don\u2019t have any soap or disinfectant\u201d \u2026 that\u2019s why it smelled so bad. He was apologizing that they have nothing to take care of that. Bob said, \u201cYou can\u2019t be in here anymore – you\u2019re not adjusted to the germs and you\u2019ll get sick.\u201d He just pushed me on through the building. What bothers me so about that is it seems like something that should be so easy to address. It seems like it, but then it\u2019s so complicated when you try to do something \u2013 there\u2019s all kinds of obstacles to seriously address those issues.<\/p>\n Q: Management style \u2013 what advice would you give the new president?<\/strong><\/p>\n I have been saying to Gary, don\u2019t try to manage it all \u2013 it\u2019s not possible. Trust the people who have the various areas of responsibility. Don\u2019t interfere just because you think you might do it differently. If you can live with it, go with it and trust people. Don\u2019t second guess them, even though in your mind you might. To do that to people who are in a position to decide is to micromanage them. Things will begin to slip by you because you\u2019re focusing too much on one area. That\u2019s one of the lessons I\u2019ve passed on to Gary.<\/p>\n I\u2019ve learned how incredibly dependent I am on my administrative assistant. We\u2019ve complemented each other. I\u2019ve had three administrative assistants in 10 years and I\u2019ve leaned heavily on them. Those have been fun working relationships. My lack of interest in details requires a person there to keep track of it – you learn not to worry about some things.<\/p>\n I told Gary, no matter how much you travel, it will never be enough. Be careful that you set some limit. If you let people tell you that you have to be here and there – if you do that, you\u2019ll burn yourself out. You\u2019ve got to evaluate.<\/p>\n Gary has said to me, I want to serve the whole church as you have served the whole church. I\u2019ve told him . . . you have a much wider church than you might have had as a pastor or even in a department. You\u2019ve got a wider church, and you\u2019ve got to move toward and build trust with people who wonder if you\u2019re going to accept them or their ministry, or whether you don\u2019t like what they do or how they do it. You really need to move towards those people . . . to help those people feel like just because my preference is different from yours doesn\u2019t mean that I don\u2019t recognize that you have a valid ministry. But, Gary\u2019s very good at that \u2013 he\u2019s very good at finding the good in people and acknowledging it, so I didn\u2019t really need to tell him that. He knows it and is very good at it.<\/p>\n Another thing I\u2019ve told Gary is to be sure you don\u2019t ignore certain kinds of places or churches. Get to all kinds of churches \u2013 small churches, large churches, rural churches, urban churches, suburban churches, mega-churches. Be open to being in touch with all of them. I have offered to go especially to small town and rural churches \u2013 we have a lot of those, and a lot of them have anniversaries coming up. And I said anytime you can\u2019t go, I\u2019d be happy to go. I particularly enjoy going to settings that remind me of my own background \u2013 rural Nebraska. I thrive on that \u2013 I can relate really well. I\u2019m going to continue to work with Gary particularly in the area of trying to keep funding some of the things that we\u2019ve got going \u2013 seminary scholarships, Paul Carlson. I\u2019m eager to do things Gary has invited me to do to keep those areas funded.<\/p>\n And, then, I\u2019m going to work with Sojourners. I had a few opportunities, but the reason I chose Sojourners is because their agenda is broader than some of the other organizations. Some are focused on international, poverty, some more on domestic or some other fairly narrow piece. Sojourners has a broader agenda. For example, I will be working on getting church leaders to an event next spring in Washington D.C. \u2013 hopefully a meeting with the new administration to talk about the church\u2019s agenda for the new president. Whether it will involve an actual meeting with the new president is yet to be determined \u2013 that is the hope. If not, then with people in the administration, to allow church leaders to share their thinking and what can be improved. It would be around the issues of poverty, compassion and justice.<\/p>\n Q: Any special word to pastors?<\/strong><\/p>\n I have often said that the most challenging work for me has been my time as a parish pastor. I do think that is one of the hardest roles because of the scrutiny and accountability \u2013 you know, you\u2019re living right there in the midst of your work. I have great admiration. Some of my friends now are retiring \u2013 and some of them spent their entire career serving in the local church. I have great respect for that. That\u2019s a hard and demanding road.<\/p>\n Q: Do you think about the day you will walk out your office door for the last time as president?<\/strong><\/p>\n Yes, I have. Fortunately, I know what I\u2019m doing next and I\u2019m quite excited about that. When I first announced my retirement, I went through a period of grief and occasionally second-guessing. I\u2019ve had enough time \u2013 it\u2019s been a year since I announced and people knew \u2013 to adjust. So, I don\u2019t think it will be as traumatic walking out the last time as it felt when I first announced it.<\/p>\n The Annual Meeting was a good indicator for me. I was not overcome with emotion. That was because I had already grieved. I had already started \u201cthis is the last time I\u2019ll do this and this is the last time I\u2019ll do that.\u201d I was able to enjoy the celebration and get up and talk. I\u2019m quite an emotional person, really, but I was able to get up and speak and not get terribly choked up in the process. I think it\u2019s been good to have that lengthy period of time. I\u2019ve done a lot of \u201clasts\u201d already.<\/p>\n What I think will be difficult is that I have a lot of things to go through and organize for the Covenant Archive, like my personal notes. The archivist talked with me about the importance of those things. I\u2019ve got notes on meetings and things that are packed \u2013 I will take them with me so that I can go through them and make sense of them and put them in some kind of context. I think that will be difficult.<\/p>\n
\n
\nQ: What accomplishments bring a smile?<\/strong><\/p>\nDiversity: “I didn’t start that by any means, but we did make a lot of progress.”<\/h6>\n
\nI feel good about the diversity issue. I didn\u2019t start that by any means, but we did make a lot of progress. It\u2019s also an issue where we have a long way to go. We\u2019ve got a lot to work through. I think there are segments of our church that feel somewhat neglected or left out. I think that in the years just ahead of us, that\u2019s going to continue to be addressed.<\/p>\nWebsite: “That has grown and is growing – it’s changed the church.”<\/h5>\n
“I can’t go to an airport luggage carousel without thinking of Jim.”<\/h6>\n
“It was so hot – you could just hardly be in there.”<\/h5>\n
![\"Glenn\"](\"http:\/\/www.covchurch.org\/uploads\/3-\/fE\/3-fElMmuXlJzQAY2EViIeQ\/Don-Glenn3.jpg\")
I find that your weaknesses get exposed in a job like this. I could do my own review and critique areas where I\u2019ve discovered my own weaknesses and, to some extent, areas where I have done a good job.<\/p>\n
\n
\nQ: What will you do in retirement?<\/strong><\/p>\nThe role of pastor: “That’s a hard and demanding road.”<\/h5>\n